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If the Apostles, Disciples and the early Christians of the first 3 centuries didn't need or require all the creeds created at the Ecumenical councils in the 4th century, or all the prayers that have been written mostly in the early middle ages up to the 19th century, Why are they deemed so important... I understand that the creeds were a way of the church clarifying what we believe and to stop all the heretical teachings at the time etc.. But regarding prayer, the list of prayers which were mostly written through the ages from the time of the desert fathers up to recent times weren't around at the time of early Christianity so why are they so mandatory??? Shouldn't they be optional and just the prayers that Jesus taught such as the Lords prayer be mandatory??? Surely, what Jesus taught his followers was sufficient... Surely the prayers that were used by the early Christians of the first 3 centuries were adequate??? This is not a criticism, just a question I’ve often asked myself...
Answer to Question 456 As the Church grew, so also did different understandings develop concerning the two natures of Christ, the Holy Spirit, and the Trinity, which divided the Church into two or more camps. In general, these different understandings developed from two rival catechetical Schools, those of Alexandria and Antioch. Both played an important part in the understanding of who Jesus was, but each used a different approach. The First Ecumenical Council was summoned to deal the heretic Arius. Arius was a Christian priest in Alexandria, Egypt, but of Libyan origin. It is believed he studied at the Antiochian Theological School under its founder Lucian of Antioch. For a while Lucian himself fell under suspicion for heresy and was excommunicated, but was later reconciled to the Church and died a martyr’s death on 7th January 312. Antioch overemphasized the human nature of Christ and some teachings may have influenced Arius in developing his ideas and theology. Having returned to Alexandria, Arius taught that God the Father and the Son did not exist together eternally. He taught that the pre-incarnate Jesus was a divine being created by God the Father at some point, therefore the Son is a created being. Arius and his followers appealed to the Bible verse where Jesus says that the father is “greater than I”. (John 14:28)
The main work of the First Council was to prove that Christ was equal and consubstantial to the Father, that he was truly God and not a creation. Arius’ teaching was officially condemned by the Church as heresy. The Council summing up the Christian faith gave us the Nicene Creed, the statement of faith which was then completed by the Second Ecumenical Council of Constantinople in 381AD.
As for prayer this also developed as the Church grew. In the beginning the Apostles followed the Jewish form of prayer and supplemented it with prayers that had a Christian content. The Divine Liturgy was purely Christian and the first Liturgy we have is that of St. James, the Lord’s Brother. This was not a standard form and in many areas the framework of the Liturgy was basically the same, but different prayers were added. The Liturgy of St James was extremely long and in the fourth century St. Basil revised the prayers or rather wrote a new Liturgy which was shorter but still lengthy. St Chrysostom took St. Basil’s Liturgy and shortened it even more to the Liturgy which we use on most Sundays today.
Same member But if Jesus said that saying the Lords Prayer 3 times a day was sufficient and no need to say endless prayers etc, why didn't it stay like that... I have admit, when ever I have a conversation or debate with a Protestant, this is the one thing I cant answer and end up conceding on that point... Simply because I cant find or know an answer...
Reply When did Jesus say that we must say the Lord's prayer 3 times a day?
Same member sorry my mistake... Jesus gave the Apostles the Lords prayer... The Apostles who were lead by the Holy Spirit practiced it 3 times a day as instructed in the Didache...
Reply But that doesn't mean they didn't have other prayers, they followed the prayers of the Synagogue and they daily had the Breaking of Bread which was not just breaking bread as a protestant might interpret is, it was the Divine Liturgy.
Westerners not used to the Orthodox way of praying often accuse us that our Liturgical prayers are repetitive and. Yes, they are - by design: “Again and again, in peace, let us pray unto the Lord.” In this way the Orthodox Church is simply following the command or Our Lord that we should be persistent in prayer and not half-hearted. Twice in St. Luke’s Gospel, Our Lord commends people who are persistent in asking: The first is the friend we go to at midnight to ask for three loaves of bread because another friend of ours has visited us and we have nothing at home to offer him. And although the friend doesn’t want to get out of bed he gets up not because you are his friend, but because of your persistence and gives you as many loaves as you need. (Luke.11: 5-8) The second is the parable of the unjust judge. The Lord spoke this parable to show that men should always pray and not lose heart, He said: “There was in a city a judge, which feared not God, neither regarded man: And there was a widow in that city; and she came unto him, saying: Avenge me of mine adversary. And he would not for a while: but afterward he said within himself, Though I fear not God, nor regard man; Yet because this widow troubleth me, I will avenge her, lest by her continual coming she weary me. And the Lord said, Hear what the unjust judge saith. And shall not God avenge his own elect, which cry day and night unto him, though he bear long with them? I tell you that he will avenge them speedily.” (Luke18:1-8).
Another repetitive prayer is the “Jesus prayer”: Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me a sinner. People are quick to remind us that the Lord warned against vain repetition by which he meant hypocritical babblings. There is nothing vainly repetitious in the use of this prayer. Any believer who prays it must do so consciously, focusing on each word and the whole meaning. If it is used mechanically then yes it can become vain repetition. The Jesus prayer is a simple prayer used throughout the day to keep our minds on God thus fulfilling what St. Paul said that we should “Pray without ceasing”. (1 Thess. 5:17). How would a protestant answer to Paul's direction that we should PRAY WITHOUT CEASING?
Same member true, but a these endless prayers that have accumulated over the years didn't exist back then... I'm not saying we shouldn't add or create new prayers... Just think surely they should be optional rather than part of the daily cycle... I always get the impression when reading the Bible that Jesus was teaching simplicity rather than long lengthy forms of worship...
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